Getting stuck in 1st gear

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Permalink Reply by Ian Pellant on November 30, 2009 at 6:54am

Hi Herb,

The screaming first gear in Auto is the nature of my smart too. I have the pulse with turbo and it just loves to rev with the turbo spun up, then refuses to get out of first without a nudge into manual or take the foot off and wait a few seconds... and feel really embarrassed.

What works better is to ease off on the accelerator after the car moves a few lengths, it will then shift into second, then hoof it a bit.

My hypothesis is that the auto program is designed to kick down when the pedal is pressed past the kick point... this sort of acts as a lock when in first because it can't kick down, so it just refuses to upshift.

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Permalink Reply by Leon on November 30, 2009 at 2:17pm

It happend to me this morning and it is not the first time.
I swiched shifter from D to Manual and back. It helps.

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Permalink Reply by Herb Bell on December 3, 2009 at 11:26pm

Hi, Ian; You replied "The screaming first gear in Auto is the nature of my smart too. I have the pulse with turbo and it just loves to rev with the turbo spun up, then refuses to get out of first without a nudge into manual or take the foot off and wait a few seconds... and feel really embarrassed.

What works better is to ease off on the accelerator after the car moves a few lengths, it will then shift into second, then hoof it a bit.

My hypothesis is that the auto program is designed to kick down when the pedal is pressed past the kick point... this sort of acts as a lock when in first because it can't kick down, so it just refuses to upshift".
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The only problem I have with gently caressing the accelerator while in first gear in order to make a reasonably good upshift to second (at a mere 10 mph!) is that cars behind me don't expect me to actually slow down as I wait for the upshift to occur. This is not only dangerous, but also embarrassing.

I've tried to do the 1-2 shift manually, but it's not a major improvement. The 1-2 lag in manual is still too long to be safe. It occurred to me today that all of the shift points occur at too low an RPM unless one is in a hurry, in which case the 1-2 shift is totally inappropriate because it's out of character with the remaining shifts. Could it be that Smart is using just one shift program, the one designed for the diesel engine? First gear is virtually useless in my gasser.

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Permalink Reply by Ian Pellant on December 4, 2009 at 3:25am

Herb,

I should have mentioned that I am in Australia. From all previous posts about the transmission, it became apparent that the first release of the USA model had a very different Auto program than the one that came on my pulse... The USA does not get the pulse model which is set for sport rather than economy. Also, Auto is an option here; the majority of pulses are manual shift only. That said, I paid extra for the Auto, because it came in the package with leather seats, electric mirrors, etc. I also bought the optional turbo.

I really don't use the Auto much. It is a complete jerk most of the time. From a standing start, the only way to keep it smooth is a slow start up and let it ease into second before going a bit quick. By a bit quick, I refer to the turbo pulse being able to do 0 to 60 kph in less than 5 seconds on a road dominated by diesel SUV's that do it in 10. I normally drive gently from a standing start in traffic full of trucks and SUV's If I have a V8 behind and nothing in front then the smart is allowed to show it's pace.

First gear Auto on mine is not much use in parking lots either. The smart is quite happy doodling in second when in manual mode. Put it in Auto and keeps hunting up and down.

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Permalink Reply by Herb Bell on December 3, 2009 at 11:38pm

Reply by Leon on November 30, 2009 at 2:17pm
It happend to me this morning and it is not the first time.
I swiched shifter from D to Manual and back. It helps.

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Thank you for your reply. Did you use the shifter side-wobble (D->M->D) while gassing it in first? Did it actually upshift much faster? If the answer is "yes", then there must be an electro-mechanical way to get around the slow 1-2 shift. Thanks - I'll give this procedure a try, hoping for the best.

My 2008 Passion received the 2009 transmission software last July, which cuts the 2008 1-2 shift time by 50 %, and it's still too slow. This is why I posted my question on 30 November. As long as there's no one behind me when the traffic light turns green, I can live with this situation.

Regards, Herb

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Permalink Reply by Herb Bell on December 4, 2009 at 1:18pm

Reply by Ian Pellant 8 hours ago
Herb,

I should have mentioned that I am in Australia. From all previous posts about the transmission, it became apparent that the first release of the USA model had a very different Auto program than the one that came on my pulse... The USA does not get the pulse model which is set for sport rather than economy. Also, Auto is an option here; the majority of pulses are manual shift only. That said, I paid extra for the Auto, because it came in the package with leather seats, electric mirrors, etc. I also bought the optional turbo.

I really don't use the Auto much. It is a complete jerk most of the time. From a standing start, the only way to keep it smooth is a slow start up and let it ease into second before going a bit quick. By a bit quick, I refer to the turbo pulse being able to do 0 to 60 kph in less than 5 seconds on a road dominated by diesel SUV's that do it in 10. I normally drive gently from a standing start in traffic full of trucks and SUV's If I have a V8 behind and nothing in front then the smart is allowed to show it's pace.

First gear Auto on mine is not much use in parking lots either. The smart is quite happy doodling in second when in manual mode. Put it in Auto and keeps hunting up and down.

Hi, Ian;

Aha! There's a different transmission program in your machine! That puts another face on the problem, doesn't it? I agree with your comment that there may be a some kind of locking action in the transmission program that keeps the car in first gear when the accelerator is pressed past the kick-down point.

In another posting here, I speculated that SMART could be using a transmission program, intended to match the diesel engine's torque curve, in the gasoline-only US cars that come only with the Automatic Transmission. Just a thought, engendered by a comment made by someone that his engine was always lugging in "D" mode.

Last night, I saw a posting here by "Dyno" (refer to "Latest Activity" column on the right of your screen) that offers a complete remapping of both the engine and transmission computers for $550. The ad says it makes the SMART behave like a sports car. Interesting. Why isn't SMART coming up with this stuff?

The local Smart dealer's stock of used Smart Cars is growing by leaps and bounds, probably due to just this one glitch with first gear. Nothing else in this car draws as much ire and criticism from owners. It's also been said that the Brabus version's transmission works much better. A bit of not-so-clever marketing going on here?

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Permalink Reply by Ian Pellant on December 4, 2009 at 4:42pm

I hate to rake over old coals, but I believe that smart USA made four significant marketing decisions that are detrimental to sales:
1) smart USA determined that all Americans need full automatic transmissions, so they ignored the rest of the world where smart manual is normal and the jerky auto is an addon. This exposed smart to a savvy auto market with a transmission that was never designed to be full auto.
2) smart USA only imported the "pure" and "passion" models. They did not import the "pulse" which is the sports version with wider wheels and tires.
3) smart USA did not provide the factory turbo option.
4) smart USA import a faux BRABUS. The "real" BRABUS has the tweaked up turbo-charged engine. The US version uses the same non-turbo donk as the pure / pasion. Very much a sheep in wolfs clothing.

So yes: I accuse smart USA of perpetuating some "not-so-clever marketing". Add 'em all up and they risked their sales figures to decline. The rest of the world now gets mhd as standard on all non-turbo petrol smarts... where is smart USA standing on this one?

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Permalink Reply by Herb Bell on December 4, 2009 at 7:08pm

Heh! Penske, Inc., thinks all is well. Frankly, I don't get it. Mr. Penske came up in the race-car business - he should know better when it comes to the mechanics of car design and should have insisted on drive-testing the product before committing to it. But not really being a trained marketing man is a disadvantage. It's easy for a slick willie to pull a fast one on him. So apparently, he was talked into whittling down the list of options available on the SMART, which benefits no one in the end except the dealers (reduced stock of spares required). What IS true is that few young Americans presently know how to drive stick, but older folks do. And what age group is Penske targeting? Why, the youth group, of course. I suggest that they have another look at the age statistics of their actual buyers, though. I see a lot of middle-agers driving Smarts here in Florida.They're after the high mileage, not the cute factor. I don't get the Brabus being sold in its present configuration either. All sizzle, no steak. Brabus is a well-respected German Speed Shop!

I've been trying to buy a diesel Smart since test-driving one in Frankfurt in 1999. It had the automatic, but I don't recall it having the present balky 1st gear. I finally bought a Smart this year because I got a good deal on a used one, and knew of the 1st gear problem in advance. Mercedes re-flashed the transmission for me free of charge, gave me a new battery, and greased the shifter. Nice. The 1-2 shift is now 50% faster. Now I have a tiny car which leaves enough room in the garage to store two bikes as well. That's my entire reason for wanting a Smart. Yes, I have low expectations, and I wasn't surprised when my low expectations were met (heh!). I always wanted a Diesel Smart, but these are only sold in Canada! Why?

I've got more of the Brit mindset on all this - modify the dickens out of these little cars and ENJOY the result. I've had to rebuild, improve and repair many bikes in my lifetime, and enjoyed the process, so the Smart is not much of a challenge for me. In most respects except for the tranny, it does just what I want it to do. And it's NEVER ground the gears once during a shift, which is much more than I can say for my own shifting skills. What's MHD mean?

Thanks for raking over old coals with me. Maybe Penske will read and heed.

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Permalink Reply by Ian Pellant on December 5, 2009 at 8:54am

mhd is smart "micro hybrid drive"... and NO it is not an electric / gasolene hybrid.

smart have replaced the traditional starter motor and alternator with a large generator / starter unit and coupled that via a drive belt to the engine. Feed it power and it starts the engine, stop feeding it when the engine starts and it becomes a generator. It is constantly in drive. The engine can be stopped and started at any instant... the engine may be shutting down but can be re-started before the crankshaft has stopped turning.

In practice, the smart engine switches off when the car drops below about 8kph with the foot brake held on, as in stopping at a red light. Keep the foot brake held down and the engine stays off. Release the foot brake and the engine instantly restarts. The air con and other systems have been modified to run when the engine is off and the battery was bumped up in capacity. mhd is standard on all 2009 Australian non-turbo smarts. mhd can be switched off or on by the driver at any time. I test drove one and it works extremely well. In stop light ridden cities, it is claimed to save up to 30% fuel consumption.

I use a Scangauge.... I can see that a lot of fuel is wasted when the engine is idling at stop. I guess I could save about 10% fuel in my average commuting drive by using mhd, which I don't have. mhd is not suited to turbo charged smarts (I believe that is due to the turbo not liking to be cycled on and off so frequently and so suffers a shortened life expectancy.) mhd cannot be retrofitted to existing cars...

mhd is another miss for smart USA?

re the tranny.... I now use the paddle shifters exclusively and they are very quick and smooth once I learnt to find them when going round corners.... (where's that xxxx paddle?... need to learn to keep the hands in the control spot when cornering ) The smart has a dry plate clutch which is servo operated via a computer. Using the paddles at the right time that the computer agrees with (engine speed compared to drive train speed) and the shifts are very fast. Just like doing a racing change with a traditional foot clutch and gear shift... but the paddles are switches and a computer has to accept your input timing.
The Auto program is like a teenager tackling a stick shift for the first time... slow and jerky.

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Permalink Reply by Herb Bell on December 7, 2009 at 4:36am

re the tranny.... I now use the paddle shifters exclusively and they are very quick and smooth once I learnt to find them when going round corners.... (where's that xxxx paddle?... need to learn to keep the hands in the control spot when cornering ) The smart has a dry plate clutch which is servo operated via a computer. Using the paddles at the right time that the computer agrees with (engine speed compared to drive train speed) and the shifts are very fast. Just like doing a racing change with a traditional foot clutch and gear shift... but the paddles are switches and a computer has to accept your input timing.
The Auto program is like a teenager tackling a stick shift for the first time... slow and jerky.

Agreed!

I hesitated to use the paddle shifter for the same reason you mentioned: Flapping wildly around the steering wheel to upshift in a turn! But the paddles are absolutely perfect when accelerating straight ahead. Even 1st gear becomes perfectly usable, and the tranny works like any manual gearshift. Than you fore the suggestion!

Herb

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Permalink Reply by Kevin Warren on December 10, 2009 at 6:25pm

And I thought it was just me?

I would love to know what causes this.

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